Mary Anne's Father - really strict?

[Natasha]

Richard is growing on me in my reread. I just read Dawn's Big Move and he was hilarious in this.

[mallorypike]

I think in the first four books, he was kind of on the strict side. Especially in Kristy's Great Idea, from Kristy's point of view. Not being able to call after 6 PM, thus having flashlight conversations with Kristy? That's kind of weird. And Mr. Spier not letting MA spend her babysitting money, therefore not letting her go to the pizza party/sleepover was sorta strict, too. After all, it was HER money that she EARNED all BY HERSELF!!! I also understand, though, since he was probably trying to teach MA how to be responsible with money, and stuff like that. I get that, I guess. Wearing little girl clothes/not allowed to choose her own clothes at 12, and forced to tie her hair in braids is odd. It doesn't make sense, but I guess Mr. Spier's just old-fashioned.

However, after book 4, when MA saved Jenny's life, he really loosens up. He went from strict to relaxed--in some ways, too relaxed. Allowing a 13 year old have a steady boyfriend (I understand if she had a "relationship" like most middle school girls--you know, sit with "boyfriend", call him, and break up in a week...but actually dating?? No way!) is very unlikely for most parents, even the "cool" ones. Allowing her to ride with teenage drivers like, oh, I don't know, Charlie. Allowing her to go on all those vacations, like halfway across the world. (when I was even older than 13, I wouldn't be allowed to go to Europe at ALL!) Allowing her to babysit random people's kids (nowadays, parents wouldn't let that happen--13 year olds today don't usually babysit, it's not common anyway). Hell, he barely has ANY rules.

So, no, he's not really strict if you don't count the first four books.

[wenonah4th]

Even the clothes,given when the first four books were written, isn't as far-fetched as it sounds all these years later. The idea of "school clothes" and changing from them to other clothes was still around for some people, and except for the wackiest of fashions, kids and teenagers dressed way more conservatively (and modestly!) than they do today. Just watch some 80s movies.

[stolenbooks]

In the beginning with the first few books, I thought he was strict, but as I read on and then read Mary Anne's book-especially that ballet chapter-I saw him as a caring single dad that was trying to be both a mom and a dad. Rereading the first four books after that, I realized that as a child, him and Mary Anne had been close. He didn't realize that things changed as girls got older, he was clueless until Mary Anne spoke up. And once she did, he was happy to let her change her room and start dressing a little less childish.

Also, I definitely don't think he was so strict after that when he let her go on all of those trips. And then date Logan who she was in LUV with, at the age of 13. I think Richard was jus misunderstood. When you read it as a teenager, you feel empathy for Mary Anne but then when you grow up, you just realize what an awesome father he is.

[zoar3]

^I agree, Stolenbooks, about Richard being misunderstood. I like how you put that. I do think if he and MA truly did have such distance between them and (to me) a feeling for MA that she couldn't go to her dad much at all, than that is plain sad I have always been a Richard fan, it is so obvious how much he loves MA in MA's portrait when the two of them greet one another after he comes home form work. I will always wish we had gotten to read even in memory of their weekly Sunday dinners at a restaurant (this was also mentioned in MA's Book) and of course, that the two of them had enjoyed (to our knowledge) one such meal as we knew them.

The only thing that ever jumped out at me and raised a little question of Richard was when he thought MA was in 6th grade when in fact she was in 7th. Maybe the two of them really were distant? I also never liked that his parents were not part of stories, loved that his father was a mailman (I think MA tells us this in Dawn and the Impossible Three) and as I have posted on that before, what a cool way of walking through Stoneybrook thaty would have been (mail route) and into more BSC history.

[stolenbooks]

I think they definitely grew apart somewhere down the line. In Mary Anne's book, from my memory, it skips from her elementary school days when her and Richard were still close to when she's in 8th grade, discovering Verna. Something may have happened during that year.

I was always under the assumption his parents passed on. I thought it was mentioned early on that both sets of MA's grandparents were dead and that's why she was shocked about Verna.

[zoar3]

^I believe MA did tell us exactly that. I wish Richard's parents had been alive or at least his dad. I will never believe that a whole lot of Stoneybrook Grandparents had already passed on by the time the girls were 11 and 13. Grandpas were (to me) much more noticeably absent than Grandmas. I think if I had been in MA's exact situation I may have been angrier at Verna and Bill than Richard, though I do feel he should have let the choice (much earlier) be MA's. I am glad though all of them got to move on and hopefully did grow closer.

[stolenbooks]

Mar 12, 2006 18:01:39 GMT -5 macca said:

It's possible that Richard was just assumed that girls like pink frills and wear dresses and skirts, but if Mary Anne had voiced her dislike of those things and he made actual rules to ensure that her room stayed looking like a nursery and that her hair was always in braids, not only is that unusually strict, it's downright weird.

Mary Anne's dad wasn't really strict past those first few books, though. There weren't any restrictions on her and she had all the same privileges as her friends, especially once Sharon came on the scene.

An old quote, I know, but this is what I've been thinking lately. I think she just could never stand up to him, yet complained about it.


I pointed this out in MA Saves The Day, but I wonder why the other parents didn't say anything about her still dressing like that. Like, why didn't Lisa ever pull Richard aside and talk about Mary Anne becoming a teenage girl? It just seems like something one would do. I know she worked a lot, but I'm sure she was able to notice it at some point. 

[stolenbooks]

I mean in Mary Anne's Makeover, she's so scared to ask him for a haircut but he's totally on board for it. And he buys her makeup! I just think he's one of the best parents in the series.

Let's look at it this way...if Kristy or Claudia were in MA's situation in the first few books, personality wise, they'd have zero problems standing up and saying "Uh, hey, I think I'm too old for this. Can I start wearing something like this and maybe redecorating my room?" Bam. I know there wouldn't be much of a story but a big part of me thinks it was MA's personality of why it went on so long.

In Mary Anne's Book he seems like a sweet single father. He seemed a little strict, but was a good dad overall.

I know I commented on this thread before, but I've been thinking about it lately!

[LadyDru]

In the first few books, most definitely..the braids (though I think the style is cute), not wearing pants, wearing little girl stuff, having a nursery-esque room were all ridiculous, as well as not saying yeah..but not being allowed to say shut up, gross or retarded, not so much...I mean, I had asked Ann M.Martin about "shut up" being forbidden and she said it wasn't allowed in her house when she was growing up because it was disrespectful and inconsiderate, which I suspected was the reason. But after book 4, I'd say he just learned to find the balance.

[mallorypike]

I feel like Richard went from super duper strict to really relaxed. He literally went from making MA wearing braids and not allowing pants to letting her be in a serious relationship with Logan at age 13 and traveling to several places WITHOUT Richard.

[CharlotteTJohanssen]

After the fourth book he really has loosened up. I've come to like him a little more.

[Sideshowjazz1]

I like Richard. I think we don't really get to see him being extremely super-strict because he loosened up in Mary Anne's first book, admitting that he underestimated her maturity after the incident the book was named for. Then he lets her redecorate her room, stay out later when she babysits, and wear her hair loose. Richard never came off as especially strict after that. He's still old-fashioned as dads go, and definitely has clear boundaries that he won't cross, but not quite as much as the books make out. He's got a clear parenting style that we get to see in detail, and that is definitely a good thing to look at in a series about looking after children.

A question we could raise here is if the parenting style adopted by each child's family affects the way the sitters handle their jobs. Like, is Mallory more lax - or strict - because her family keeps things relaxed, things like that. According to "Dawn's Book", the reason Dawn doesn't let kids play gun or weapon games is because her friend Sunny told her that kids need to know that weapons aren't toys.