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Post by zoar3 on Sept 19, 2011 16:30:36 GMT -5
If anyone did the "holding together" post Watson, it was Nannie. Well Nannie and in a different way, for David Michael, Andrew, and Karen, the BSC. As much as I don't like Nannie (overall) if it weren't for her becoming Emily's mother, I think things would have fallen apart fast in the TB household. Aside from being the BSC chauffeur, Charlie finally had a little more of a life, Sam seemed to be involved in a lot of school stuff in addition to his part-time job, and Kristy was the BSC. Whenever Kristy or another BSC member wasn't sitting, Nannie was always in charge after school, weekends, etc. I have not read many LS books so I can't give impressions on Elizabeth and Watson's parenting in them. It did seem that while much stricter, Lisa was more involved with her kids than E and W. I know having a smaller household probably helped with that. I always wondered what would have happened had they, Lisa and Seth, had or adopted a child? I was surprised that never came up even.
As for the dunce Patrick, I do wonder how he met Elizabeth. I could see them as having grown up together or maybe she met him in college and he "woo-ed" her away. I think at first his carefree spirit might have been a draw for Elizabeth and something she wanted her kids to grow up with (someone who could be spontaneous and was young at heart). After a while, his true colors showed and it became all about him. Whatever, he's a first-class jerk. As for Elizabeth, like most all of you, I was only a fan of hers in KGI.
In Ann's book "Inside Out," two of the characters are named Elizabeth. One is the older sister of James, a little boy with autism. Her nickname is "Lizzie." The other, is a teacher at James' school. My point is, over the course of the book she (teacher) is often referred to as Edie. Maybe Ann saw some of her in "our" Elizabeth.
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Post by virgoscorpio on Sept 19, 2011 16:58:28 GMT -5
Why do you not like Nannie, zoar? Just curious.
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Post by sparklymouse on Sept 19, 2011 18:09:41 GMT -5
One thing that bugs me is that she had so many kids with Patrick. I mean, she knew he was irresponsible and she continued to have sex with him, risking the chance of bring another child in the world (and that's what happened when she became pregnant and later giving birth with David Michael). Did she think she could change him or that he would change for the better? Heh, there are ways to have sex without getting pregnant. Elizabeth had birth control figured out for five years after Kristy, so it's pretty probable that David Michael was planned by her. (By Patrick, maybe not?) They would have hired someone if they didn't have Nannie. I have no doubt in that. Nannie didn't bother me because she moved in specifically to do what she was doing. She wasn't mooching off of anyone or being taken advantage of. Lisa did seem more involved, but she was also a stay at home mom. As soon as she went back to work, she got a nanny of her own. I'm pretty sure Karen did push for a baby when Nancy's mom was pregnant, and Lisa was like "Uh, no." |
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Post by zoar3 on Sept 19, 2011 18:24:05 GMT -5
^ That is very true. The thing is we were (conveniently)? left out of the conversation where Elizabeth and Watson invited/asked/begged? Because of that, we never got to find out just what they told her. I mean did one of them flat out say, "our 2 year-old toddler (I'm sorry but to me EM should never have been labeled a 'baby') will be arriving soon from Vietnam and we'd love for you to be her caregiver during the workday and 90% off the rest of the time?" Okay, in fairness to W and E, that probably evolved once the Brewers saw how attached Emily had become to Nannie.
That was my long-winded way of saying Nannie probably knew what she was getting into and obviously made her choice to stay but the arrangement (probably because no one from the adoption agency or CWS ever questioned it let alone checked on Emily) always seemed "off" to me. I think what bugged me most about Nannie were her chapter 2 descriptions and that where she was, so, too, was Emily. At first Emily was cute, etc but she didn't grow on me. Of course, finally, we will also never know just what Nannie's relationship was with Elizabeth prior to her move into the mansion. All these "holes" leave lots of room for our speculation (which is fun :]) but at times, also, aggravating.
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Post by virgoscorpio on Sept 19, 2011 19:18:26 GMT -5
Yeah, I agree that Nannie did not have it too bad (if that's what you meant, zoar). She does get to spend time with her grandkids and her daughter everyday. She (probably) lives rent free. She gets to be around other people instead of being lonely -- and if she wants alone time, the house is so big AND she has her own room. She can leave and do other stuff. I do not think she had it that bad, and I think a lot of older people would love to be in her position.
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Post by zoar3 on Sept 19, 2011 19:33:43 GMT -5
Actually I think she was (let herself) taken advantage of. Regardless of her reasons for the move, it would seem to me that once it was clear Emily thought of her (Nannie) as "mom" to the point of truly having difficulty separating even for a team event (Kristy tells us in Dawn's Big Move, that Emily is on a different team--for the Run for Your Money Fundraiser than Nannie, assuming E remains okay with that) that there should have been some discussion between Elizabeth and Watson (and Nannie) about re-arranging their schedules. Yes, I know in "Mr. Mom" Watson supposedly declared himself a full-time family man after noon each day and it was sweet how in "Kristy and the Missing Fortune" Watson had a "Barney date" with Emily, but otherwise, (I think) Nannie was still Emily's primary caregiver. I'm not saying that is bad or good, just that it seemed to be the case. ITA that Nannie was very lucky in the respects of health and also having a comfortable home to live in (and one where she wasn't alone). I guess, like the other characters, as the series went on Nannie lived mostly through her chapter 2 caricatures. I wish we had seen more of her "live." If we had, my opinion on her may have changed.  |
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Post by anzuhana on Sept 19, 2011 19:55:31 GMT -5
Oh, I know there are ways to have sex without getting pregnant. If David Michael was planned by either one, it seems strange since they were having problems. Elizabeth being pregnant and then having David Michael probably would've made things worse between her and Patrick.
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Post by virgoscorpio on Sept 19, 2011 20:06:32 GMT -5
Yeah, especially if he did not like being chained down to a family (as the books suggested). After all, 4 is a lot harder than 3 (duh!) Even though 3 in itself is a lot of kids...4 seems like so many.
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Post by sparklymouse on Sept 19, 2011 21:44:34 GMT -5
Was it said when they started having problems? I always thought it was after DM arrived. It seemed like something about DM's existence made Patrick snap.
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Post by anzuhana on Sept 20, 2011 9:09:23 GMT -5
Elizabeth and Patrick were having problems before David Michael arrived. I looked at Kristy's Portrait and it said that during the years that Elizabeth and Patrick were married, they argued a lot. And that sometimes Patrick would say things like "I'm fed up with this life" or "I'd be better off without you and the kids."
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Post by virgoscorpio on Sept 20, 2011 17:58:52 GMT -5
I never understood why he got married AGAIN, and probably goes on to having MORE kids. My Dad did that. There is an over 10 year age gap between me and my oldest half sibling. And I wonder why a guy can be a really good Dad to some kids and not another... maybe I am venting  |
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Post by anzuhana on Sept 20, 2011 18:03:17 GMT -5
^ Patrick didn't remarry just once, he remarried twice. Maybe he thought that the third time would be the charm or that the next wife would be better.
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Post by virgoscorpio on Sept 20, 2011 18:19:00 GMT -5
Thanks, anzu... I guess I missed the fact that he remarried twice. Do you remember who the two women are and where we find about them in the books?
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Post by anzuhana on Sept 20, 2011 18:32:39 GMT -5
The third time he got married was to Zoey in Friends Forever Kristy's Big News. You only know that was married a second time by reading The Complete Guide To The Baby-sitters Club. The book doesn't mention the name of his second wife.
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Post by zoar3 on Sept 20, 2011 19:32:48 GMT -5
^I thought one of his wives was with him at the Giants game in "BSC in the USA?" Or was she still a girlfriend?
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